00:01.62

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Welcome to another episode of Tech in EdTech. I'm really excited to get started and introduce you all to Kelly Philbin. She's Director of Core Adoptions at IXL Learning. And Kelly, thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate you joining us today.

00:21.46

Kelly Philbin

Thanks, Olivia. I am thrilled to be here. Thank you for having me.

00:25.45

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, well, I know that we have some thoughts on what we wanted to talk through today, but I want to just start off just learning a little bit more for our folks who are listening out there, so they can understand a little bit more of your journey. You know, I know that you also kind of started from the education space, similar to myself, and you've moved through HMH, Heinemann, Frog Street, before landing at IXL. And so, even in the process we were talking earlier, you picked up a PhD in literacy and reading. And so, I wanted to sort of, you know, I noticed that's a really deliberate arc from classroom, publisher, researching. And I was curious, like what has pulled you through each of these moves?

01:09.05

Kelly Philbin

So, well, I will tell you, first and foremost, I'm proud to say that, as you noted, I started my professional career as a teacher. I spent over 15 years in the classroom, and I actually began teaching second grade with 37 students and no technology. So, I definitely learned a lot very quickly then. And then, that moved me into, you know, at one point during that opportunity, I was asked to be a pilot teacher for an educational publishing company. And I was like, I really love the experience and really seeing the other side of how publishing has such a vested interest in education. So I was fortunate to move into educational publishing, and that gave me the opportunity to work with educators and districts across the country. I was able to lead large-scale curriculum and technology implementations in some of our largest districts. And then over time, that work expanded into leadership and curriculum strategy, which gave me the chance to look at some of these same challenges now from a much broader perspective. And, as you noted, today I'm the Director of Core Adoptions at IXL Learning. Here, I lead a team of content experts, and I work closely with educational leaders and our curriculum development teams here. And one of the things I really enjoy about my current role is listening to what schools and districts are trying to accomplish. Also, really understanding the challenges they're facing, and then bringing what we hear in the field back into the work we're doing at IXL. So, I feel like it's a full circle moment, you know, being in the classroom, experiencing those challenges, and then, from an educational publishing perspective, and now at a broader scale, working with the content team and our development team.

03:10.68

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, I love to hear that. I think there's so much that can be gained from that classroom experience. And just as you said, you know, it's changing every day and certainly different from when either of us was in the classroom.

03:18.11

Kelly Philbin

Sure.

03:23.48

Olivia Lara-Gresty

But, just thinking about just, you know, really grounding, you know, how we're trying to support students and teachers in research-backed processes is really, I think, something that can't be overstated in its importance. I think that's something I wanted to really dive into, just, you know, thinking about when we think about how we can really set up students and teachers for success. I wanted to think a little bit about when core programs really have to serve thousands of classrooms, you know, tens of thousands of students. Where do you see that necessary instructional coherence can start to turn into like rigidity for teachers and even for students themselves?

04:08.09

Kelly Philbin

Yeah, that's a great question. And I almost think of this like taking a trip to Disney. So bear with me for a second. So, when you think about taking a trip to Disney, we all know where we're going, right? That's our common destination. But we all don't have to get there the same way. So some may choose to fly, some may drive, others may take a train. The route might look different, but we're all headed to the same place. And I think curriculum should work the same way. Like our standards are defining where students need to go, you know, what they need to know and what they need to be able to do. But students may need different paths to get there. And that's where a strong core curriculum really matters. It's going to give us that common destination and a coherent path forward without becoming so rigid that teachers can't respond to the needs of students. They, you know, the students that are sitting right in front of them.

05:04.31

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, I think that that's, and you know, as any teacher in the classroom, there's so much that's being, sort of, done in the moment to actually adapt to even just, ah you know, thinking back, I had students, I taught the same class before and after lunch, and that is a very different student group that walks in depending on how the day is going.

05:21.01

Kelly Philbin

Right.

05:22.54

Olivia Lara-Gresty

So, there's a lot that we… we know that teachers are capable of when it comes to adapting to their group on the day or the, you know, overall. But I think that it brings a lot of questions in terms of how, you know, both districts and also the learning providers can support those teachers in those in-the-moment changes. I'm curious when we think about… you mentioned, sort of, you know, we're thinking a little about personalization. I know that's a core offering and core value that IXL thinks about. And I wanted to think a little bit from a district perspective. So we're talking a little bit about the value of the core curriculum, as well as the adaptive and supplemental work that teachers are doing as well around that. And so, when districts actually bring in some of these adaptive or supplemental tools and programs to support around the core, where do you see the ownership of the learning progression going towards in the in the effort to make sure that personalization doesn't become too fragmented?

07:10.60

Kelly Philbin

Yeah, that's a great question. So, I think the district leadership has to be really clear on what the expectations are. And this is the direction in which we want students to move. But ultimately, the classroom teacher is the expert in the room, right? So it is a shared responsibility. They have to be the ones, right, taking ownership of it, knowing what their students need the most. So again, the district sets like the big picture guideline, and this is the direction we want to go. But we have to trust teachers to be able to use those resources and tools to make the best instructional decisions for their students.

07:50.97

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, and I think that that's something we were talking a little bit beforehand as well. You know, I think teachers deserve an immense amount of trust, as, you know, just they know their students. When does, like, I also want to think about the work that those teachers are putting in. And when does adding more scaffolds or pathways and just the choice stop actually supporting that personalization, but rather becomes extra cognitive planning load for those teachers?

08:18.14

Kelly Philbin

Yeah, that's a great question. I think personalization breaks down when it becomes an add-on. So, when you think about, like, if we have so many different tools, resources, and even data points that aren't connected, then to your point, like, that burden really falls on the teacher to try to figure out how is this all going to fit together. And personalization, it isn't about just adding more resources, right? It's making sure that we are enabling and encouraging more responsive teaching. So, as a classroom teacher, I think, you know, teachers need to know who's stuck, who needs some additional support, who's ready to move ahead. And I think that's where having everything connected just becomes so important. So, when instruction and assessment, differentiation and practice all work together, what we learn about a student can actually help inform what happens next while still keeping that student connected to grade-level learning. Because ultimately, right, that's a responsibility of the classroom teacher. We need to make sure students are being exposed to and learning grade-level learning. So, when personalization is built into the learning experience from the start, instead of being layered on, it really becomes a more natural part of teaching and learning. And it's not just one more thing that teachers need to do.

09:41.11

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, you make a great point. And I think thinking at building it in from the get-go. I think something when we, when I think about personalization, often I hear like adjustments of the pace or maybe the difficulty levels based on the students' performance data, as you're mentioning. But I'm curious: anything beyond, you know, what should these programs really understand beyond just the students getting right or wrong answers? What are things that you think about to make sure that those programs are not just personalized, but also helping the student, again, get to those goals, that their learning objectives?

10:19.00

Kelly Philbin

Yeah, another good question. I think, you know, we have to understand much more than whether a student gets an answer right or wrong, right? So, that tells us something, but it doesn't necessarily tell us why the student answered that question incorrectly. So again, is there a misconception? Are they missing a readiness skill? Are they able to explain their reasoning? And I think two students can get the same exact question wrong for completely different reasons, and they may need completely different support. To me, that's why real-time assessment is so important. We want to understand what students are thinking in the moment and then give teachers the opportunities to respond right away. One example that I really like is in our new core takeoff. It's called Group Jam. Some of our listeners might be familiar with Group Jam. But, in that moment, every student is working on the same question at the same time. And then the teacher is able to immediately see how students are thinking. So, if several students are struggling with the same idea, teacher can stop right there in the moment and address it. Or if a student is ready to go deeper, teacher also has the ability to take them there. To me, like that's personalization happening in the moment. The technology is not making the instructional decision for the teacher. It's really giving teachers better information so they can make that decision.

11:53.40

Olivia Lara-Gresty

So, I'm almost hearing like arming the teachers with the information; helping them get the information that they need so that they can, as you said, you know, make those in-the-moment choices based on what they know about their students.

12:06.58

Kelly Philbin

Sure, because when you think about it, teachers typically have a lot of data points, right? But what helps them that they have data points that are going to direct them to instructional choices and know exactly what they need to do for a particular student? Because if we give them all these different data points and no direction, then is that really helping them? And again, it kind of goes back to that: here's one more thing, and then they have to try to figure that out.

12:34.74

Olivia Lara-Gresty

So rather than just like surfacing the signals, there's also opportunities to help the teacher make those kinds of instructional decisions to actually support those students in that moment.

12:45.74

Kelly Philbin

Correct. Correct. And then it also really helps them, right, with their scaffolding, right? And that's where that comes into play.

12:50.30

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, I think that the trust in the teacher to make those final calls is really great to pull on and even connects back to a little bit with some of your own research. I think you mentioned, when you were chatting, that you did your dissertation on multilingual learners and, you know, the challenge that can pose for teachers who are often not given the resources to prepare. So, I wanted to just touch a little bit on how you might connect that to some of these personalization tactics and supports that we can provide, but for teachers.

13:26.84

Kelly Philbin

Yeah, great question. This is a topic, as we were chatting, you know, I feel really strongly about. Because sometimes I think there's a misconception that a student's proficiency level, in terms of their language proficiency, you know, it's not a measure of their ability to think. So, making content more accessible should never mean, for these students, that we're going to make it less rigorous. We have to be able to remove those barriers without lowering expectations. And one of the things I really believe strongly in this is that we also can't put all that responsibility on teachers, again, and expect them to figure it out on their own. This is where we need the support, right, of high-quality core curriculum programs, just to help them by having those supports built directly into their learning experience. And again, what are some ways that we can do that, right, to be able to support those students when we think about that personalized learning, you know. In a lot of cases, which has been, you know, really effective, is making sure that content is accessible to all students by visual supports, right? We may do some modeling, manipulatives. Opportunities for student discourse in the classroom is so important. And also translations. It's one of the things that I'm so proud that we do so well at IXL, you know. Our languages are we're available available in over 120 translations, which is, you know, unbelievable. But what a great support for second language learners. But again, I said this little bit earlier, you know, it goes back to that scaffolded access and not necessarily the expectations that we put on these students.

15:23.06

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, and I think…

15:23.16

Kelly Philbin

If that makes sense.

15:25.50

Olivia Lara-Gresty

It totally does. And I think, as you were saying, you know, English proficiency isn't the same thing as the understanding of the concept. And so, I think, you know, understanding what we're really trying to measure makes a huge impact in how we create products and tools that support teachers.

15:44.41

Kelly Philbin

Yeah.

15:45.05

Olivia Lara-Gresty

And something I think about as well, we've started to touch on, but I think efforts to make content more accessible, whether it's linguistically or when it’s about scaffolding, I think there's the risk that these adjustments can make the thinking work less demanding. And, you know, I know that that's something with many, like AI tools, that's a huge concern, even just, you know, our own day-to-day use is just really making sure that we're supporting that cognitive, you know, demand while also focusing it in the right ways.

16:01.67

Kelly Philbin

Well,

16:15.30

Olivia Lara-Gresty

So I'm curious, yeah, how you think about that.

16:17.85

Kelly Philbin

No, I was going to say, I think the other part, just to continue this a little bit, the other danger that can happen is that, again, we're underestimating what a student's capable of, and then we personalize in exactly the wrong direction. So, let's take, for example, let's say a student may understand a mathematical concept, but they don't have the English language skills to be able to fully explain their thinking. So, a teacher could interpret that as a learning gap. And, if that's interpreted as a learning gap, then that student might be given easier content or, really, even moving them, you know, backward when what they really need is the language support to be able to engage with that grade-level learning. And again, it goes back to, you know, what we've been talking about. It's why good personalization has to go beyond, like, identifying what a student got wrong, right? We just have to understand why they struggled and what they need next with that actionable data. Because again, if we diagnose the wrong need, then we're going to prescribe the wrong support. And then, that can unintentionally limit a student rather than helping them to grow.

17:33.30

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, I think that distinction is really important. That there's, you know, a language gap or a learning gap could look identical from the outside.

17:41.35

Kelly Philbin

Mm-hmm.

17:41.93

Olivia Lara-Gresty

And so, but as you said, you know, they need different responses. And so, what do you think about when you're designing assessments or tasks to really isolate the, you know, the gap for a student? And how can that, and so we can make sure that the teacher isn't, kind of, left guessing in the moment on what's actually the gap for that student.

18:03.32

Kelly Philbin

Well, I think there's a few things. Again, I'm going to go back to that in-the-moment assessment, right? And assessment takes lots of different forms, right? So, you know, I'm going to do my formative assessment, my summative assessment. But one of the things that I love the most in takeoff is our personalization days. And what we do on a personalization day is, after a student takes an assessment, we're not just handing the teacher a set of scores and saying, oh, here you go. Like, here's the data. The data actually identifies which students may need additional support, who's mastered the content, who might be ready for enrichment, and then it connects them to what they can work on next. So, it's adaptive in nature. So, students are always getting exactly what they need in the moment. So, that's that actionable data. We're not just telling teachers, hey, this is what happened. Now, like, we're helping them figure out what to do about it. And again, you know, you and I were both in the classroom. When you think about even today, right, the limited time that teachers have. The easier we make it, right, to move from insight to action, the more useful personalization becomes.

And again, who's the winner in the end, right? Are students. I used to say this all the time when I would either deliver professional development, even in my own classroom. I mean, we make the same; it sounds so simple. As a teacher, I have one responsibility, and that's to meet the needs of all the learners in my classroom. That sounds simple to say, right? But when you really think about it, that can be a really overwhelming task when I think about all those diverse needs. So again, just having that actionable data and being able to direct the teacher, okay, this is what we're seeing, but this is what you can do. And that's game-changing in the classroom.

20:02.46

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, I mean, when you when you mentioned that the teacher's responsibility, maybe it's my own experience, but, you know, meeting each learner's individual needs does not sound easy. But I think, to your point, it is also the reality that a teacher is, you know, tasked with every single day is to do their best to actually meet that. And I think it sounds like… when you guys are, you know, designing your curriculum, you're really thinking about the actual workflow that a teacher has to operate in. You know, what makes these personalization insights actually useful rather than something else to just sort of figure out. And, I think, a lot of systems that I've seen, you know, I always think about when we're designing products that sometimes less is more. 

20:46.09

Kelly Philbin

Yeah.

20:49.41

Olivia Lara-Gresty

And so, you know, not having endless insights and suggestions. And so I'm curious, what have you seen that makes this information actually usable for a teacher in the small windows that they have to either plan or, in the moment, respond to student needs?

21:03.16

Kelly Philbin

Yeah, well, I would say, you know, it's quick and easy. We've taken the guesswork out of it, right? So I literally see it right in front of me. So I'm going to go back to even that group jam. I work on something with my entire class, and I get that in the moment. And I can target, I can teach, we can practice, and then we can move on. But the thing, I think, I like the most about this is, you know, we think about students who might need some extra support, but what about my students who really need that enrichment? Like, how are we, you know, we have a responsibility for those students to also continue to grow? And that allows us to be able to do that by having that in-the-moment data, right? It's the same thing with the, I mentioned those personalization days. In some units we're doing that more than once. So we're checking in, you know, every five to seven days and making sure that all of our students are, you know, where we need them to be. And, if they're not, I'm going to stop and do what I need to do, in the moment, to make sure that they are accessing and being exposed and being successful, probably most importantly, with that with those grade-level standards and grade-level content.

22:21.14

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, I love that you mentioned also students who need enrichment, how to support them.

22:25.23

Kelly Philbin

Mm-hmm.

22:25.46

Olivia Lara-Gresty

I think it's something that, you know, as a teacher, we focus a lot on students who are at the cusp, who are just, sort of, between, you know, sort of, maybe, passing or failing or even higher. We also want to make sure that those students who are really performing actually have that, you know, continuous challenge. That sort of Goldilocks-level of challenge to kind of keep them going and stay motivated.

22:36.34

Kelly Philbin

Mm-hmm.

22:48.72

Olivia Lara-Gresty

And, I think that, you know, it brings in that no curriculum can really anticipate every classroom. No teacher really can anticipate every classroom, although a teacher, you know, they get pretty good. Where do you think about… like where the product's responsibility can really extend to which that curriculum can actually support some of this personalization and suggest, you know, next steps and suggestions. And where areas that you think, you know, it's really responsible for professional learning to support teachers when they're making these decisions.

23:23.64

Kelly Philbin

Yeah, that's another good question. You know what, I do not think there should be a hard line between the two. And when you think about, you know, the curriculum and then where that professional learning begins, the two really, you know, work together. Again, curriculum has a strong responsibility, right? To provide that strong grade-level content along with the scaffolds that we talked about and supports, and then also giving teachers options, right? The professional learning piece of it really helps teachers understand not just how to use those resources, but why they're there, and how to use them. I often say we want teachers to use the program as it's intended. So, we don't compromise the coherence or the integrity of the curriculum. But we still want to give them the flexibility to respond to the students that are in front of them. And that's really the balance, right? We want them to be consistent without being rigid. So, the curriculum is going to provide the foundation and the tools, and then professional learning helps teachers use them well. And then, we need to trust teachers to make the right instructional decisions for their students as a result of that, I would say, that partnership.

24:42.84

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, and you bring up a good point again, where, I think, all of these tools are really to bolster teachers and, you know, not just save them time, but make them more effective at what we know that they do best. And I'm curious also, when you guys think about, you know, feedback coming in from teachers or implementation teams. How do you tell the difference between areas that might be, you know, hinting towards recurring instructional friction and then other areas that might be just local preferences that really are something that are more in the teacher's domain to shift or adapt as needed?

25:19.03

Kelly Philbin

Yeah. So the first thing I always look for is patterns. So, if we're hearing the same thing from teachers across different schools or districts, then I know that's something we need to pay attention to. I do think the bigger question is, what problem are they actually trying to solve? So, I may have one teacher asking for a very specific change, but then, like, when we dig a little deeper, we might find that the real issue is pacing, right? Or maybe it's just something like how something's fitting into their instructional day. And, like, that context really matters, because sometimes what sounds like a product request is actually like a much broader instructional challenge. And then other times it might be something very specific to a school or district. So, for me, it really comes down to listening, making sure we're asking the right follow-up questions, and then looking for patterns. We don't want to just respond to the solution someone's asking for. We really want to understand the problem that we're actually trying to solve. And again, it's one of the things that I really enjoy about being IXL because we're so in tune and have strong partnerships with our customers that they're always sharing a lot of what they're seeing and what they're hearing and just giving us really good feedback. And it honestly was the impetus for building Takeoff by IXL because everyone knew how strong IXL is at personalized learning. And we had so many requests that said, hey, we love how you do this in supplemental. Would you ever think… could you do this in a core program? Because we really need that. And we really literally took that feedback and created Takeoff. But that was a lot of listening, right? Over years, looking for patterns, asking follow-up questions. Because again, we want to make sure what we're doing is solving a problem or coming from a true need that educators have that will, in turn, positively impact student learning and student achievement.

27:33.18

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, well, I think it's, I always love to hear, you know, folks in the EdTech space who, you know, make a point of listening to the teachers that they're working with.

27:41.78

Kelly Philbin

Yes.

27:41.82

Olivia Lara-Gresty

So any teachers out there, it sounds like IXL is actually listening if you're reaching out. And, I guess, something you were mentioning there, you know, really focusing on what is the real problem that you're trying to solve. And so, I think, you know, while standardized test scores are something that help us, kind of, measure student success, of course, we wanna make sure that we're, you know, getting, you know, students ready for just the world at large. And so, something I'm thinking about is just as, you know, when you're looking at - if personalization is really working the way it should- what are other things that are… other signals that are worth watching beyond standardized test scores? Maybe even things that change before the standardized test scores, just given that those are also given at those sort of regular intervals. I know that you all mentioned that you have pretty frequent check-ins every five to seven days, but just anything else that you think about that you see typically improving based on effective personalization?

28:37.66

Kelly Philbin

Yeah, well, we should definitely see movement right well before it shows up on a standardized test. So yes, as you just noted, I mean, definitely I'd look at formative assessment, right? So I want to make sure, yeah, I'm checking in. Are there fewer misconceptions that we've seen in the past? Are students able to apply what they've learned in a new context? But I wouldn't look at that assessment alone. We should be seeing changes in engagement, right? Are my students more confident? Are they able to be more persistent in the work that they're doing? Am I seeing them participating more? Working through their challenges? Are they able to explain their thinking? You know, it's one thing, as we talked about earlier: I can get an answer correct. But can I explain that thinking, and can I transfer it? I'd also look at what's happening with teachers, you know. Are they now able to identify student needs more quickly and respond in the moment? Are they now spending less time, right, searching? We talked about resources and spending more time teaching when, if personalization is really working, we should see it in student learning, student engagement, and also teacher practice way before it shows up in any kind of standardized test.

29:55.61

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Those are great signals. And I think, also for school leaders that are looking to you know get a sense of how they can support their teachers or just improvements being made, I think each of those points to some really, you know, both key signals to look out for and also if, you know, formative assessments, for example, aren't regularly included, how to really think about when and where to include them so that you can actually measure you know effectiveness of those personalized programs.

30:16.79

Kelly Philbin

Yeah. Mm-hmm.

30:23.41

Olivia Lara-Gresty

I wanted to just touch on a few, you know, a few questions that might… a mini lightning round just around some areas that I think we've been really talking about. And so, the first one I had was just a sign that you have noticed where maybe a core curriculum has become too rigid. What's something that you might notice, or that a school leader could look out for?

30:46.94

Kelly Philbin

Yeah, I think this is when, you know, it starts to mean that every student has to do the same thing at the same time and at the same pace, right? Everyone's going to work from this one book. We're all going to do the same lesson. Again, it's important. We need a common standards-aligned destination, but students don't all have to take exactly the same path to get there. To me, that's a big red flag when that's the expectation.

31:11.35

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Well, and then I agree. In the reverse, is there one personalization feature that you've seen that can often create more work for the teacher or the student rather than more value?

31:23.67

Kelly Philbin

Yeah, it's, you know what, it's that data without action. So again, if a data tool and assessment is going to identify what a student needs, but then like leaves the teacher to totally figure out what to do next, like, is that really helping the teacher? Like, I don't think so, right? So good personalization, like, should answer two things. What does the student need? And what can I do next? 

31:51.26

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, I think having action, you know, an action process is huge.

31:54.39

Kelly Philbin

Yeah.

31:55.50

Olivia Lara-Gresty

And one last question is, I do think it's really interesting to think about your own work, and there are just there are millions of students in the US who are multilingual learners. And so, it's something that you know many teachers are thinking about. Are there any assumptions that publishers and education providers should really retire about multilingual learners in order to better fit their needs and their learning requirements?

32:19.45

Kelly Philbin

You know, absolutely. We just need to retire the assumption that limited English proficiency means limited ability. It does not. When you think about these students, they've already mastered one language, right? And we're asking them to learn another one. Like a student who's learning English is no less capable of thinking deeply or being able to reason or engage with rigorous grade-level content. I just… I feel very strongly our job is really to remove those barriers and not to lower expectations of these students.

32:56.02

Olivia Lara-Gresty

I fully agree that, you know, just thinking about the effort being done to just translate or just learn another language. You know, I took Spanish in school, and that was a whole class. And so, just imagining, you know, what those students are going through, you know, appreciate you just calling out their immense capability, despite, you know, some of the challenges that come along with just having some extra, you know, learning that's needed. Well, I mean, this has been an amazing conversation, and I'm curious for anyone who's listening in: where is the best place to learn more about the work you're doing and what IXL is doing in terms of either your roadmap for teacher offerings or how to best use those offerings as well?

33:38.52

Kelly Philbin

Well, absolutely. So anyone can connect with me on LinkedIn. And I'd also encourage everyone to visit IXL.com to learn more about the work that we're doing here at IXL. And let me say, one of the things I enjoy most about my current role is talking with educational leaders, hearing about goals and challenges. And again, we take a lot of what we hear in that feedback as we continue to create solutions that are truly going to make an impact in education. So love to be able to continue to have those conversations. And again, I just really, I want to thank you for the opportunity. Again, talking about, you know, strong grade-level core curriculum. And again, I know we talked a little bit about Takeoff and, you know, our new core offering. But it really brings together so much of what we talked about today. Because again, it starts with that strong grade-level core curriculum, but it's connecting the instruction, the assessment, the differentiation, that real-time data, and that personalized practice, all in one experience. So again, not going to have to layer all different things. It's all connected in that one place, and that it really helps teachers. And I think what I'm most excited about is, you know, helping teachers move from knowing what a student needs to actually knowing what to do next and not to have to search through lots of tools and resources. So, we're doing lots of exciting things over here at IXL. You heard me talk a lot about assessment too. So, just a great assessment suite to provide so much actionable data for teachers. So yeah, be sure to visit the website or reach out to me directly on LinkedIn. Love to continue the conversation.

35:26.78

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Yeah, and Kelly, I think just from what you're mentioning, you know, just it's so clear how much heart has really gone into the Takeoff curriculum and just the products in general that you all are developing. And really, again, it's so encouraging to hear, you know, teams that are really seeking out and implementing teacher feedback. And so we just love to continue to follow the journey and see, you know, how teachers respond when you get into the back-to-school not too far from now.

35:53.75

Kelly Philbin

That's great. Thank you again for the conversation. I really enjoyed it.

35:58.17

Olivia Lara-Gresty

Thanks for joining us.